Could you guys make a glossary for us new guys?

[Skiprat]

Hi puzzle nuts
I love reading the threads that you guys have got going and find them very interesting. But I seem to glaze over when I try to read the long 'decahedron' type of words. Now that you guys have got several of us pen makers hooked, please would you give us some definitions of these terms in laymans terms? Nothing fancy, just the basics please.

The next question I have is about puzzle etiquette. In most forms of art, imitation is a form of flattery. But to me it seems that express permission needs to be granted before you can attempt to copy a puzzle design. Is this correct?

I know I could just go and buy a book or look it up online, but I think this forum would really grow if you 'old hands' were willing to show us newbies how to get started with the basics.

pretty please

TIA
steven

[Roby]

Feel free to copy anything I make without reservations.  Unfortunately, I don't make blueprints or instructions, so you will just have to settle with cracking one of mine open to see how it works.   

[gibell]

It's not that easy to describe complicated 3D geometry in a few sentences.  A lot of diagrams are required!  Stewart Coffin's book: Geometric Puzzle Design, is very well written and I heartily recommend it.  You can buy the latest version from Amazon, or browse the older edition (which is almost identical as far as I can tell) online at Puzzleworld:

http://www.puzzleworld.org/PuzzlingWorld/

I also recently purchased "Shapes, Space and Symmetry" by Alan Holden.  This is a classical book on polyhedra that has many photos of models.  It is also pretty user friendly.  But it does not say anything about puzzles.

It may be that some expert can make a glossary of the major terms.  You would need a lot of diagrams, though.

By unwritten rule, it is nice to acknowledge the inventor of a certain puzzle if known.  For a lot of old designs, the original designer is not known for certain.  Other puzzles may actually be patented or copyrighted.  In this case you could actually be sued if you make a lot of copies of it, I suppose.  Stewart Coffin talks about these issues in the introduction of his book:

http://www.puzzleworld.org/PuzzlingWorld/introduction.htm

[Roby]

Honestly, a lot of the terms you geometric puzzler guys use are foreign to me.  I have no concept of them, but can sometimes figure things out by the context.  I figure that the same works the other way.  Out of necessity, I have made up a few words to describe certain aspects of puzzlebox crafting that really don't have definitions outside of us puzzlebox makers, and I figure that to some degree the same exists for geometric puzzlers also. 

You pen turners recently called a particular technique/effect "feather", which was foreign to me, but I could figure it out by the picture.  I would have called the same thing a "triple helixical" but feather works just as well.  When you put pen and feather together, I picture one of the 17th century pens made from a real feather.

We all could use a glossary, but perhaps it would suffice if we all just considered that several differnt woodworking generes exist on this forum and support all of our technical vocabulary with visual aids so that everyone knows what we are talking about. 

[rolly_wood]

The next question I have is about puzzle etiquette. In most forms of art, imitation is a form of flattery. But to me it seems that express permission needs to be granted before you can attempt to copy a puzzle design. Is this correct?

I think we have to agree before about what concerns specifically a design and, on the other hand, what is related to the underlying geometrry of it.

When it is said that a block of a Philippe Dubois puzzle has the angles of a 12hedron nothing is disclosed, it is simply evident by the geometry. When I describe how I would make that piece with the saw, it is only for doing such a geometrical shape, probably the inventor did it in a different way.

But, I agree that posting a photo of a copy of someone else's design, having acknowledged him, but without asking a permission, is a rather questionable thing.
I did it and the most part of puzzles I made are non authorized copies. On the other hand I never sold any puzzle and vertIgon (the first one I try) is my design.
I am a geometry fan and I like to discuss about it in this community but as a puzzlemaker I am a newby
Of course I do not want to infring any fair rule, then I expect from you, experienced puzzle people, guidelines I will be happy to follow.

Thank you for having risen the problem. 

[Canuck]

Hi puzzle nuts
I love reading the threads that you guys have got going and find them very interesting. But I seem to glaze over when I try to read the long 'decahedron' type of words. Now that you guys have got several of us pen makers hooked, please would you give us some definitions of these terms in laymans terms? Nothing fancy, just the basics please.

I'm with George, reading Stewart's book will most certainly fill any gaps and makes a nice introduction to anyone starting out.  There's tons of 'actual puzzle' examples on 'Puzzleworld' as well, that's where I would start and in fact that is where I started many years ago.  Even now and again I'll go back to confirm something or look up a puzzle design

[Canuck]

The next question I have is about puzzle etiquette. In most forms of art, imitation is a form of flattery. But to me it seems that express permission needs to be granted before you can attempt to copy a puzzle design. Is this correct?

This subject comes up a lot and in fact has been brought up recently, when starting out and making copies for one's own collection I really don't see a need for permission...however once you start selling puzzles things change completely and permission becomes a 'must'.  I'd like to relate a story here that involves a puzzle that I made when I first started in puzzlemaking;  I had made a relatively well known puzzle that I had obtained permission to make, when I was selling puzzles locally at craft type venues, years later when I decided to make a small run of this puzzle available for sale I was denied permission (initially anyway! ) as it turned out, one of the 'original' puzzles that I gave away turned up at auction and sold for a 'ridiculous' amount, infuriating the designer to no end    The other thing to keep in mind is that, sometimes the designer has already given permission to someone in a contractual agreement (e.g. Stewart's 'The Cube' aka 'Wookey Hole' or 'Hectix' licensed to '3M') 

[Chinnomotto]

Hi Skippy,

Seeing that I have been unkind to you in the past, I better make ammends

So listen very carefully, cause I  will only tell you once

In Geometry , we are facinated with polyhedras ( many shapes that forms a blob)

Most famous is the 5 Platonic solids, the Cube ( a hexahedron, 6 sided), the Tetrahedron, (4 sided triangles). the Octahedron (8 sided triangles, or 2  joined square base pyramids ), Icosahedron ( 20 triangles) and the Dodecahedron (12 pentagons)
Wayne Daniel made a 5 in 1 Platonic puzzle, available dirt cheap at Cubic Dissection, worth  buying, where all these solids fit together.
Clever dude, but he doesn't allow copies,,,,more about this later

Notice these solids have same angles and shapes, sometimes called Regular Polyhedrons, only 5 in the whole universe, discovered around 600BC. So how dumb are we not to know them

Then there are 12 Archimedean solids with funny names that fits in a family, and then there are gezellion other ones to confuse you

Most interesting is the Dodecahedron, Roly calls it 12hedron, there are over 15 types, the Penta and the Rhombus ones looks different but they are 12 sided. The Rhombus can be the Golden Rhombus where the long length divide by the short length = the Golden ratio, the other is where Stewart Coffin specialise on

Confused, good,so am I, Roly and George can correct my mistakes, but I like polys too. But then, I like pullin teeth too

They are like main family members, and there are  aunts, cousins and nephews, somewhere they are related

My favorite is the Triacontahedron (30 Golden Rhomboids) where you can do add ons(stellations ), dissect,like the Chinny, put togethers like the split 60 pieces, joined here n there


So lets move on to  ethics.

Copy what you like, just tell no one,keep it as a private collection

When you sell, and IF you sell, mention their name

If you know the maker, its polite to ask. Most will say yes, some dorks (uncool people) will say no

Main concern is if the makers do it for a living, like the Japanese Karrikurri Club

Copying then is a no no

Feel free to copy my stuff, I love feedback and variations and Improvements

Copying is honing ones skill, you think and work like its maker


As for the Crack eggs in my face, all is forgiven

Revenge is sweeter.......meet La Booma

When it opens, it triggers a light and flasher unit that goes

Tick,,,,Tick,,,,Tick,tick,tick tick,,,,KaBOOM!

Reserved for GOD



[attachment deleted by admin]

[Chinnomotto]

Dang!

Heck,last pis is the guts opened with my 1 Platypus Egg, IPP 29 bound, i hope

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Canuck]

Very well said Chinny  .....now I want, want, want; 'La Booma'    Coloured pencils rule!!!!

[Chinnomotto]

Erata 1,,,,,Its La BOOMBA! Actually its a Boo Boo, I cut the crack too short to the base. What to do?,,,La Boomba!

               This one works off the crack egg opening, next one will have its own unique openning


Erata 2,,,,When you sell copys, swear to God you got it at ebay

[Canuck]

Erata 1,,,,,Its La BOOMBA! Actually its a Boo Boo, I cut the crack too short to the base. What to do?,,,La Boomba!

               This one works off the crack egg opening, next one will have its own unique openning


Erata 2,,,,When you sell copys, swear to God you got it at ebay

Too funny!!!!!!!!!...ROTFLMAO

[gibell]

Nice touch with the lit fuse and lego skeleton!  My 9-year-old son was watching over my shoulder and started laughing his head off at La Boomba.  We will both be at IPP, looking for it!

[Skiprat]

Thanks for all the replies guys.
I probably will buy a book or two in an attempt to get my thick head around the basics.

If I continue with this new hobby, then ultimately I would prefer to make my own designs. But I'd also like to know the ins and outs of existing designs.

Chinny my friend, I'm shocked at you!!!!!!!!!!! You want to blow up GOD???  That's just a little extreme isn't it??

Cheers for now